Why the ebiker hate?

I see a lot of people on e-bikes who are well under 50, in apparent good health and/or probably on the higher end of the income bracket. It's not the e-bikes themselves or the sort of people who ride them - it's the broad attitudes of ignorance of the rules/road etiquette and outright disregard of other road users (not signalling, poorly executed turns, etc.).

If I, as a cyclist, clip another cyclist or a pedestrian, I am at best getting a bit of road rash and some nice bruises. Worst case, broken bones. If one of those monstrosities clips you with its mirror as it drunkenly weaves by, then the cyclist/pedestrian on the receiving end is going to feel it much worse than the e-biker. Worse, they act like cars and create space by intimidating other path users into giving way.

I don't care what kind of cargo bike you have, I can guarantee it weighs less than 100kg unloaded.

I am far (an order of magnitude) more likely to see one of those things go by with the driver holding a cell phone to his ear.

And don't make me laugh at the "32km/h speed limit" that every single defender trots out every time the subject comes up. That's complete garbage. I had one of these idiots weaving along behind me one evening; far too close for comfort, and there's no way he could have avoided plowing into me if I'd needed to emergency stop. I couldn't shake him at 36km/h, so I gave up and pulled off.

They are motor vehicles, and need to be treated as such. We don't let a Nissan Leaf (or any other EV) on the bike path just because it is electric, nor do we allow Vespas on the bike path just because they have 2 wheels.

The danger is that while I may commute around 15-20mph on a bike, with some descents going upwards of 30mph, I took time to get there. I had to learn the skills of bike handling and make sure I was comfortable with these speeds as I got stronger from more commuting.

An ebiker on the other hand, jumps on a bike they've never ridden before and instantly can be going 20mph with very little physical output of their own. They can skip entirely over the months of getting stronger, learning how to interact with traffic at those speeds, and learning how to plan ahead for crossing pedestrians.

I doubt very much a loaded cargo bike can achieve 32 mph.

Personally I feel they've been misclassified. If it can accelerate without having to peddle, than it's a scooter. It's an electric scooter, but a scooter none the less. The size/width of these electric scooters can be problematic, especially as whatever bike lanes we have are so narrow to begin with, add in stormsewer grates, potholes and yes, on a few occassions I have felt that a passing electric scooter is forcing me off the road. However, I have the same experience, many times more fequently, from the tour-de-france-wannabe MAMILs (middle aged men in lycra).

The problem is not ebikes, it is electric scooters with "pedals" which cannot be ridden as a bicycle. An ebike can be ridden like a bicycle. An electric scooter cannot be.

Electric scooters shouldn't be in bicycle lanes, separated and otherwise.

The easiest way to differentiate a scooter from an ebike is wheel size. If the wheel is less than 20" in diameter it cannot be ridden as a bicycle. Heavier ebikes are not ebikes. They are scooters and should require a motor vehicle license and insurance just like a gasoline powered Vespa.

I'll join the hating the e-bike crowd. Ultimately, they are neither fish nor fowl and find they act whatever way they like. I have yet to have one (or see one) actually ring a bell coming up behind someone. I have been seriously startled more than once. I actually wouldn't pigeon hole them however, as the ones I see (downtown to the east end (Scarborough) were pretty varied. I agree with Veronica that they are misclassified - if they have an engine they should be considered a vehicle - like a scooter. (incidentally, still giggling at the MAMILs... although to be fair, I'm a middle aged woman - but I DON'T wear lycra lOL).

But I think the point is that they are invading the VERY little space that cyclists have - yes, we have to ride amongst the rumbling beasts constantly; but before the proliferation of e-bikes (they have bred like bunnies), there was at least an illusion of holding a small bit of space at the side of the road - now even that is begrudged us!

I agree w. Herb - ebikers are vilified as a class beneath contempt, like "white trash". Cyclists are mad at the lack of adequate infra and turn on ebikers xenophobically.
Ebikes, it appears, are not going away and are not driven exclusively by ageing motorcyclists w. their licences suspended. All types own them. So we have to deal with two-wheeled diversity.
Like anything that annoys you, it is up to you to decide how annoyed you wish to be.

Wow, I never realized how much irrational hate there was against electric bikes.

I do agree that the classification rules are very silly, and they should distinguish between the electric assist bicycles, and the electric scooters with pedals. Requiring scooters to have completely useless pedals sticking out the side only makes them more dangerous.

E-bikes of both varieties should absolutely be permitted on bicycle lanes and paths, since they provide a car-alternative to those who are not fit enough for cycling to be a completely effective mode of transportation, namely the elderly and the disabled.

With a larger proportion of the population able to benefit from bicycle infrastructure, politicians will be more likely to invest in it, and engineers will design it to a much higher standard.

People complain that e-bikes "invade our space", which is completely short-sighted. The presence of e-bikes helps INCREASE our space through the construction of new infrastructure, which is far outweighs the nuisance of being passed by someone once in a while.

Thanks for the reminder Seymore. I was indeed lumping the scooter style e-bikes with the electric assist bicycles. Just for the record, I don't hate e-bikes (the scooter type). They just annoy me. But then a lot of other road users annoy me as well. I think it's more a function of a lack of civility and education in just about all road users.

Herb,

My experience with e-bikes (or as you correctly argue, e-bikers) has actually helped me to sympathize with car drivers who whine about rule-breaking cyclists. The problem with e-bikes is that they are often driven in the reckless fashion that we sometimes witness from cyclists, but using a vehicle that has a far greater potential to cause harm. And cyclists have the biggest problem with this because they are the ones most liable to be harmed.

At least car drivers are licensed and regulated. This summer I narrowly avoided a major collision with an e-biker as I was going through a green light northbound on Sherbourne at Carlton. At full speed, this e-biker, who was going westbound on Carlton, flew through his red light and made a left turn onto Sherbourne. He came out of nowhere; he was totally silent. I was really rattled. It's impossible to imagine a car making a move like that, and if they did, you would hear it coming.

I also feel angry when e-bikes take the bike lane because these spaces were so hard fought for, and it feels as though the "motor" culture is encroaching on the few scraps that we have won. We all know that the chances of law enforcement protecting our bike lanes from e-bikes are, well, nil.

Like some commenters here, I try to like e-bikes. I remind myself that from an environmental and congestion perspective, e-bikes are much preferable to cars. But in the free-for-all taking place right now in the city, I am terrified of them.

Micki

As Alan said, the more people using bike lanes, the better. The question is: will a few escooters in the present dissuade potential cyclists ("the 60%") from biking in the future? I want to intuitively say no: anyone who feels unsafe around escooters isn't going to feel safe when (s)he inevitably has to mix with cars, trucks, streetcars and semis at the beginning and end of even the best journeys. But I'd love to see some data and get some informed opinions.

As far as specific run-ins: if someone broke the law and endangered your life on the road, report it to the police. If TPS receives enough complaints, the police will start arresting unsafe escooterers; while there's no escooter license to revoke, I'm sure a judge could forbid a repeat offender from riding for a period of time. As usual, though, the solution to the root problem probably involves education and better public transit.

My car-driving mom, girlfriend, and many friends aren't interested in bike commuting, but they are interested in escooter commuting. I think escooters are an elegant technology, perfectly suited for urban transportation, and a great stepping-stone from car to no-car. The speed governor is enough for me to feel safe around them, but I'm not sure they should be on trails and in bike lanes. Ideally, I'd like to see them simply take over downtown streets the way gasoline scooters have in most East Asian cities, parking for free in Green P spaces, improving the flow of downtown traffic, and emitting zero toxins into the air all 2.8M+ of us have to breathe every day. The Motorino ones are especially tempting; they seem to be much higher quality than most others.

@Ben I am not sure how to reply to your outburst. You seem to be deliberately making my point about (not) getting along. Am I supposed to be afraid of you and stop posting? Do you expect me to post an equally moronic reply and start a flame war that nobody wants to read? Can you get along with pedestrians, runners, roller bladers, and other cyclists on shared use trails; and cars, motorcycles and other cyclists, and indeed ebikes on the roadway, but someone paints a line down the side of the road and suddenly you are unable to share this lane with ebikes, which after all are about the same size and speed as cyclists? If you were so concerned about safety, you would be wearing a helmet, would not breeze through stop signs and red lights, and take to the sidewalk at a whim. Which brings us back to the original question "Why all the ebike hate?".

Its not about the ebike its about the person who rides it.. whether its an ebike, motorcycle, car or bicycle it doesnt matter if you are not responsible YOU ARE THE ONE. To be HATED... peace

I was riding an ebike at night on a busy street but do to impatient drivers I had to move into the bike lane I came up behind a cyclist and had to slow down (I couldn’t safely pass him) I then understood how drivers must feel but I am also a cyclist so I was a bit worried that I might spook him with the quieter ebike. I want to buy the Organic Transit Elf a 3 wheeled enclosed bike with the option of a motor assist for large hills (The escarpment) it’s classified as an E-Bike but I don’t plan on using the motor that often.