This morning on CBC Radio one, Metro Morning's Andy Barrie interviewed several people about snow removal in the city -- with a special emphasis on pedestrians and - our favorite topic - cyclists. Our own Martin Reis was interviewed, along with Peter Noehammer (Director, Transportation Services – Scarborough District, City of Toronto) and Counclior Heaps (Chair, Toronto Cycling Committee).
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Comments
Svend
Thanks for posting the mp3,
Thu, 02/07/2008 - 14:18Thanks for posting the mp3, Anthony.
I'm glad Martin was upbeat and positive for the interview - he gave voice to a group out there that isn't as crazy as most believe. That will work to change minds and hopefully get more progress on cycling issues.
anthony
Your welcome
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 08:27Your welcome.
It is a good inteview. I asked for, and got, permission from Joe Soloway at the CBC to re-post the segment here, so my Thanks goes to Joe and the CBC!
geoffrey (not verified)
marginalising pedestrians and cyclists is unacceptable!
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 09:19I have a great deal of difficulty listening to a "media personality" publicly marginalise one group of common resource users for the benefit of another. Feb 6 and 7 Andy Barrie did exactly that in characterising winter cyclists as being "a few gears short of a derailleur" and questioning whether winter cycling as being "about transportation or was an extreme sport". His inference pedestrians were at fault for being killed by motorists on the morning of Feb 6 I found unconscionable.
Anti Bikey's err Andy Barrie's congratulation of Councillor Heaps for taking TTC over cycling to work Feb 7 was salt for the wounds of cyclists. Stating "Discretion is the better part of valour" was uncalled for. There are no weather limitations to cycling in the MTO HTA and Barrie should be disciplined for suggesting there are or should be. The argument needs to be made cycling in bad weather should be more acceptable than driving a motorised "safety cage" due to the simple matter a bicycle and rider make a much smaller crater when they crash than "motorvehicles".
Its time to petition CBC for Barrie's dismissal. Marginalising cyclists and pedestrians encourages motorists to repeat this behaviour which in turn results in more dead cyclists and pedestrians.
Barrie himself needs to be treated for obvious autoholism.
http://www.autoholics.org/programme.php
Stuart (not verified)
I too was disheartened by
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 10:07I too was disheartened by the comments from Barrie and how there wasn't really much of a response to his general idea that anyone that bikes during the winter is nuts.
I think cyclists need to be clearly in opposition to this type of attitude, it is so dismissive and it was somewhat unfortunate that most listeners weren't really given any real counter response to Barrie's car favoured ramblings.
It is this attitude that allows the city to ignore plowing bike lanes or implementing any part of the more affective parts of the bike plan.
Also I think Heaps assertion that the plowing of the sidewalks causes the bike lanes not to be clear, is not really based in reality either. I think the bigger problem is cars parking in bike lanes and blocking the ability of plows to do there jobs, but no one in this city would ever dare talk about limiting car parking during snow storms like they do in Montreal.
Anyways after I heard this interview I was even more depressed that nothing will ever change in Toronto because it is full of people that think like Andy Barrie and politicians that talk but don't act like Heaps.
darren
Andy Barrie
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 10:13Andy Barrie is one of the most thoughtful and articulate people on radio or TV. Plus, he's the master of the segue!
I think he phrased all the comments you mentioned in the form of questions (except for the props to Heaps for taking TTC). He's only suggesting what is probably a very widely held belief. Many people do not understand why someone rides a bike in the winter when there are other options. Maybe we just need to make more of an effort to explain our reasons, and explain why people shouldn't use cars in very bad weather.
The only petition I would sign is for a law that forces non-CBC radio stations to air Andy Barrie content.
-dj
geoffrey (not verified)
With all due respect and I
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 11:04With all due respect and I really do appreciate your contribution to the community Darren (by the way congratulations!), inferring pedestrians were at fault for being killed is absurd and that cyclists had no business on the roads in "bad" (?) weather is ridiculous. If he had claimed blacks had no business in Rosedale the black community would be up in arms. If he claimed gays and lesbians had no business somewhere else in public he'd be up on human rights charges.
The roads WERE built for pedestrians and efforts to monopolise these facilities by the motormayhem manufacturers and their vested interests is among the most detestable forms of subversion to be found on this planet. That Mr. Barrie would allow himself to be used by these interests is bizarre. That he would infer he is representing public interest in so doing while using a publicly funded broadcast to do so is disgusting.
Feb 6 he complained about pedestrians crossing mid-block. I would like to draw your attention to the matter that sidewalks are not always continuous. There is no sidewalk on the north side of Lakeshore Boulevard between the Humber Loop and Park Lawn. There is however a sidewalk from the Humber Loop out to Lakeshore. The closest crosswalk is at Park Lawn. Are pedestrians expected to levitate? Similarly there is no sidewalk west of South Kingsway west to the Humber Loop on the Queensway and there is chainlink on either side of the TTC tracks in the median barring crossing. Barrie has issues with pedestrians walking along the road. So how are pedestrians to get to the Humber Loop from South Kingsway and the Queensway?
Suggesting motorists question the presence of pedestrians and cyclists on the roadway will undoubtedly result in some using this for justification to act agressively against pedestrians and cyclists. This is a behaviour we MUST work to curtail. Too many have been maimed (myself included) and killed already. I'm really tired of reading yet more calls to assemble for remembrance rides and am disgusted by traffic "accident" reports in the media blaming the victims for "wearing dark clothing" while crossing with the light in the crosswalk.
Barrie requires censure until he is educated of the REAL cost of motorvehicle "accidents".
geoffrey (not verified)
ROADS
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 11:28On the subject of roads despite what some would have you believe these were not built "for cars, trucks and buses". The Romans built roads for rapid troop movements. Yes. Pedestrians for the most part. The Hun found them great for horses too. Again. The wheel was but a minor factor. In America both the Aztecs and Inca (and any number of other native communities) gained renown for their roadworks. Again, if the wheel played a role it was minimal. Our accepted history denies existance of the wheel in the Americas before the incursions of Europeans.
Roads crisscrossed the Americas in various states long before Gottleib Daimler unleashed his motormayhem machine. It should also be noted what is accepted as the modern bicycle predated this fouled air spewing contrivance by some 10 (ten) years.
It is only in the interrim that roads have been manipulated to discourage other than motor vehicle transport.
At this juncture I would like to thank the likes of Mayor Hazel McCallion, Councillor Rob Ford and Councillor Case Ootes for propogating the myth roads are for "cars, trucks and buses". The motormayhem insidioustry undoubtedly has shown their gratitude repeatedly over the years as well and contributed to your (collective) favourite (read yourselves) charities generously. Shills.
geoffrey (not verified)
more ROADS
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 11:41It was the motormayhem insidioustry that manipulated roads into physical barriers between communities rather than the communication points they had been previously. The South Kingsway wanna be highway cloverleaf and the Queensway with no sidewalks are prime examples. Relegating pedestrians to second class transport was what these engineering exercises were about.
Add in walking and riding in the smog in a perpetual state of fear due to haphazard and sometimes impaired incompetents loudly buzzing by inches away in multiton motorised safety cages in the shadows of shills hawking papers describing the latest pedestrian casualty count does not do one a wit for confidence in their future well being.
This "community" of conspiracy we have been acceeded to by the motor industry must be curtailed.
Svend
When the roads are a mess, I
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 12:13When the roads are a mess, I would also congratulate Heaps for taking the TTC. It's crazy to berate anyone for making a sensible decision like this. I wouldn't care if he never touched a bike during the winter at all, he supports those who do.
I don't think Barrie was taking a position, he was presenting the commonly held view and getting a thoughtful response from each person.
Martin Reis (not verified)
Passion & Car Culture
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 12:23I can feel you passion, Geoffrey. And I am thankful. Point well taken.
A 2 ton vehicle on icy roads is unsafe at any speed and indeed car culture is the real enemy to be addressed.
I thought about this before the interview and chose not to address car culture in this case in order to focus on the bike lane plowing issue. It's part and parcel of the same issue certainly but I find that on air is best to focus on one thing at a time.
For thousands of years Cities were built for pedestrians. Now we design them for cars.
We all working to return cities to pedestrians and cyclists or those modes of transport which cause the least harm.
Without being patronizing, thank you for your passion Geoffrey.
darren
Culture
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 12:54Thanks for the kind words, Geoffrey.
I do agree that it's important to question and oppose the assumptions made about the car's dominance in our cities.
I won't bother defending everything that another person said. But I'll point out that CBC often does refer to traffic collisions as that: "collisions", or as "crashes", often avoiding the word "accidents". And I think his comments about pedestrians crossing the road were made out of concern for people's safety. Something about being extra careful when stepping over a big snow bank. In the part of the show I heard, the innocence or guilt of a driver wasn't brought up.
By the way, I hope you get somewhere with that car that hit you. It sounds like it's been quite a challenge. I was hit by a car earlier this year, filed a police report, and haven't heard anything since.
-dj
Martin Reis (not verified)
Update on unplowed bike lanes
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 17:07Dropped by College and Spadina today and area. They have done nothing to clear the bike lanes ... yeah, they're busy all over. I know.
Seems to me the city needs to re-think it's way of dealing with snow ... it's simply not working.
I will keep taking photos of College and Spadina, etc. and post them on Flickr.
http://www.flickr.com/martinreis
later.
geoffrey (not verified)
culture and passion
Fri, 02/08/2008 - 17:40I'm sorry. I keep missing this part but Martin gave a great interview. The way it was framed he stayed positive. If it were me more harm than good would have been done. bikelanediary has long been inspirational and motivating to cyclists and bloggers. Ode to Olmo is a beautiful piece. Olmo bikes were first stamped on my consciousness there and I've met some lovely examples up close and personal since.
Darren you are correct in citing the "stepping over snowbanks" reference. Nevertheless the context suggested pedestrians were at fault for the 6 fatalities cited to date.
Thankyou for asking about the collision. A Mr Brown from McLeish Orlando informed me I was not of worth and would not consider my case of worth and that any testimony I provided in court regardless of documentation provided would be treated as hearsay.
A Mr Ali Rashid #9497 and sometime police officer reamed me good..
Luke (not verified)
Don't hold back Geoffrey,
Sat, 02/09/2008 - 12:06Don't hold back Geoffrey, tell us what's really on your mind! ;-)
No facetiousness here - I couldn't agree more. Your frustration is palpable, I empathize. Sometimes it's all you can do: rage against the relentless oppressiveness and stupidity of our auto-cracy. When all else amounts to nothing let loose the splenetic salvos. LOL!
As cathartic as that is, it's also an admission of powerlessness. Nothing ever changes. Expediency trumps merit in shaping the policies of City Hall; Joe Sixpack doesn't know Atilla from Augustus: to him the legacy of the Aztecs amounts to a vengeful Montezuma turning his colon inside out at an all inclusive resort in Acapulco. Perhaps my viewpoint is not the most productive but it's great for lowering your blood pressure: when your expectations of pundits and pols are so low you're almost never disappointed, occasionally you may even be pleasantly surprised by their insights. Progressive? No. Healthy? Well, certainly healthier than the alternative. I'd rather go biking than go ballistic.
Vis the CBC segment, a piece of puff indistinguishable from other dreck wafting across the ether. But what did you expect? Morning shows rarely enlighten, they're meant to entertain and distract. Any serious inquiries into the state of cycling in Toronto necessarily requires an investigation into so many other ancillary aspects of our culture and city. Such a cerebral offering has no place or space crammed between reports of Britney Spears psychoses and the Maple Loafs masquerading as an NHL team.
Even so, I thought that Martin Reisman and Councillor Heap presented favorably -- certainly better than I could've! No false notes, they were in harmony with the tone set by Andy Barrie: good humored, if somewhat patronizing, and casual. That's well as I suspect the bearing of Reisman and Heap has as much to do with the receptiveness of their message as its substance. Tip of the hat to both of 'em.
Luke (not verified)
Apologies. It's Martin Reis!
Sat, 02/09/2008 - 12:17Apologies. It's Martin Reis! Not Reisman. Ooops.
hamish (not verified)
where to begin?
Sat, 02/09/2008 - 12:56but the lack of plowing snow out of the bike lanes instead of into them is making a mockery of the bike network - it's not even white line riding sometimes.
The College/Spadina focus is only part of the problem - there is a Big Problem with the indented parking bays that the City is unable to plow out. Therefore the motorists park in the bike lane and no bike lane! Yet the city/urban designers are keen on replicating this design in more parts of the City eg. Roncesvalles, and possibly Bloor St.
It's not okay.
I'm truly sorry Geoffrey, that Mr. Brown doesn't regard your case as worthwhile - I did make a mention of you in a deputation on Wed., I think it was - because it's daunting to think of how if you don't have a bike lane being run down from behind when taking a lane, as I'm forced to do sometimes on Bloor because the Fire Hall has pushed their snow beyond the bike lane on a curve - hey SOL!
I have adjusted my riding, and sometimes it's not smart to be out there, but in theory the public roads are public roads, and there's marked contrast in what the City does to provide passage for the public.
Sigh.
Aidan
Andy Barrie - Cycling Union
Mon, 02/11/2008 - 08:12Everything said about Barrie is appropriate, but remember he's far from the biggest tool on cycling and urban issues. He may need a little sensitivity training on the issue, but Metro-Morning is one of our friends on all urban issues. We have to get the cycling union on the show, and regularly. Metro Morning is the most popular morning show in the city, at least last year. They reach both people in their cars, and people who wouldn't vote for Harper: people we need to reach; people worth reaching.
Andy Barrie (not verified)
Metro Morning, Bikes and Bad Snow Days
Tue, 02/12/2008 - 11:18A regular listener to Metro Morning and a regular contributor to this forum clued me into this discussion, and having seen myself characterized as some kind of anti-bike no-nothing, I wanted to get in a few words of my own.
The piece that morning was about that morning, not about winter biking in general. It was a hideous day- for pedestrians, for drivers, and for bike riders. As I mentioned, my colleague Kevin Sylvester, one of the great champions of cycling in the city, knows there are some days, if you're smart, you leave you bike at home. Just as if you're a driver, we told you that morning, it would be a good idea to stay off the roads. Just as if, as a pedestrian trying to climb over a snow bank, we warned you that people have died this winter when their feet skidded out from under them and they slipped into the path of traffic (did someone actually think I was "blaming this on the pedestrians"?! What?!)
We didn't hear from any walkers or drivers who felt condescended to or patronized by this advice. Why all this nastiness from bike riders? Are these people so defensive that they can't see that there are some days when bikes are a less-than-great choice?
For the record, I've done dozens of interviews on biking and how far behind Toronto is compared to other cities' policies. I doubt you'll find a more vocal champion of urban biking than Metro Morning.
Svend
I agree, Andy - it's a
Tue, 02/12/2008 - 11:28I agree, Andy - it's a pro-cycling show especially thanks to Kevin Sylvester's comments once in a while.
Quite a few years ago, you were the first person I heard who pointed out the word "accident" doesn't belong in traffic news - "collision" is a more accurate term. At the time I thought this was silly but you managed to change my thinking.
Carry on with your good show!
hamish (not verified)
cbc/barrie is less "carist"
Tue, 02/12/2008 - 11:51A phrase I use occasionally is that "diehards become die-easies" on some days. So some discretion is sometimes advisable. Yet that said Mr. Barrie, there are some truly outrageous and inequitable applications of civic resources that greatly enhance the risk to cyclists, and the amanglemated motoropolis of Caronto doesn't really choose to reduce these risks.
Sure it costs money to clear roads, and where does all the snow go? But far too often, all of the bike lane disappears, and it is sometimes nerve-wracking to be more than white-line riding.
Examples of lousy plowing occur especially with the indented parking bays on the Collge and southbound St. George St. bike lanes; I notice the Bloor lanes disappear east of Sherbourne.
It is helpful to know that a lot of CBCers are bike-types, and Mr. Sylvester at least has access to airwaves (I gave up my time at CIUT a few years ago post-coup/takeover, and I regard the place as tainted by sometimes quislings and collaborators). If you're able to look at Copenhagen: City of Cyclists please do - it puts Caronto to shame and shows how we can change, though in some ways it's sadly too late.
Darren_S
Dear Andy
Tue, 02/12/2008 - 11:46I have had the opportunity to be interviewed by you on air. You were very straight up with me and very fair. Not a regular listener but when I do get a chance it appears balanced.
Cyclists have every right to be "defensive" because of what they put up with every day out on the roads. Sadly this position is the norm. I would not take it so personally. Cyclists routinely have to deal with drivers who are convinced that it is perfectly legal for them to hit a cyclist with their car if they think the cyclist has broken the law. In a media related example look at the case of cyclist Patrick Lonergan. His case is not different than the two people killed this year by stray bullets. Even the little media there was surrounding the killing it had a very hard time keeping the story straight.
anthony
To Andy - Why I posted this
Wed, 02/13/2008 - 03:08The segment was good, and that is why I was glad that I was able to post it.
I refrained from commenting on it further because of your chuckle at the end of the segment, and for inviting your listeners to call in and tell you how "nuts" they thought we are. It wasn't completely clear that you were speaking exclusively about this day; that was the part that made me uncomfortable.
I find that CBC Radio does treat cyclists well; I have little to complain about. I'll continue to enjoy your show, and I'm sure that we will hear more about cycling on it. If possible, I'd like to be able to share those segments here as well.
As a rule, we don't moderate the comments here. We have found most people to mostly civil in their discourse, although some may be highly defensive and others may be highly critical. But some people are like that. I'd bet your voxbox is filled with similar comments, especially when you invite them.
And as for finding a bigger champion of Urban Cycling... I think that Matt's afternoon show puts up a good fight against your's ;-) And Matt also often mentions how he cycled down to the studio, and what he was able to see and enjoy during the ride. But at least he's on the same team ;-)
Luke (not verified)
Andy Barrie, fair enough.
Tue, 02/12/2008 - 16:53Andy Barrie, fair enough. You made your points well.
But what I find irksome is that too often whatever exposure cyclists receive tends toward coloring them as eccentric, 'extreme', or a 'a few gears short of a derailleur'. Admittedly, in this you're guilty more by association, collateral damage of the flak directed at the mediocrity of mainstream media. I suspect this is an occupational hazard you've reconciled yourself to. ;-)
Tell me, when there was a 100 car pile up on the HWY 400 a month or so ago did you characterize the participants of that demolition derby as a few cylinders short of a V8? Or on the airwaves note the parallels between the daily carnage -- in fair or foul weather! -- that euphemistically passes as rush hour traffic and a rabble of lemmings in a hurry to die? Honestly, the traffic rundown frequently sounds like a coroner's report.
Yes, I'm being facetious. But only partially.
This is what's so irksome. Cyclists can distinguish themselves by their foolhardiness or 'extremeness' in severe weather -- we expect you to comment on it. But motorists, everyday of the year, in all types of weather, prove themselves more extreme and foolish, inflicting an exponentially greater degree of damage - and not just to themselves either - and yet, beyond a terse summation of chronology, rarely is there an attempt at greater insight; or a commensurate degree of adverse attention.
I'm not urging you toward cycling advocacy -- I recognize that's not your job. I'm asking you to better consult objectivity and scale in your segments/commentaries and apply a single standard of stupidity -- to cyclists and motorists alike! -- across the board.
Keep the rubber on the road and tailwinds to ya.