I am going to start off by expanding a bit on Herb’s intro to Vehicular Cycling and John Forester. These posts are not an attempt at an wholesale assassination on ‘Vehicular Cycling’. There are many good things about Vehicular Cycling that one would be wise to consider putting into practice. I agree with Herb that some parts of Vehicular Cycling should be considered as part of a balanced approach to riding on our streets. That said, there are some suggested practices and pieces of information in Vehicular Cycling that range from questionable to dishonest to dangerous. This is troubling because quite frequently these problem areas are in the forefront, being used to obstruct the progression of all things cycling, whether it is a bike lane or legislative relief. While Vehicular Cycling converts like to describe their entire approach as a proven theory, the problems being explored in these posts will suggest that Vehicular Cycling contains a mix of various theories and hypotheses.
Vehicular Cycling is explained as the, “...practice of driving bicycles on roads in a manner that is visible, predictable, and in accordance with the principles for driving a vehicle in traffic...” What is missed in most of these definitions is the political component of Vehicular Cycling. Read any Vehicular Cycling literature and it clearly asks its converts to advocate its tenets where ever and whenever they can. Vehicular Cycling contains a political philosophy that is strongly influenced by staunch conservative values and encourages followers to promote it with religious fervor. This is not a criticism: any sort of advocacy group has different political influences and different ways of delivering their message. It is, however, important to understand how these influences present themselves, and how they shape suggested practices. In the case of Vehicular Cycling, it holds to true conservative values of preserving the way things are and resisting radical change, regardless of how beneficial change may be.
To begin this discussion it is important to start with a key definition. Every set of practices or laws relating to how to operate a vehicle on a road have a common goal; that is, to make the use of the roads “safe”. It is important to understand how this word is used to understand the goals of any proposed “safe” practice, and how it is interpreted.
How is “safe” defined? Dictionaries use an “either or” definition, you are “safe” if you are free of harm otherwise you are not “safe”. In general usage though the definition is more comparative. We ask, “Is it safe?” Meaning is there less risk than an act one is familiar with. For instance, “Is roller blading safer than taking a car?” No one assumes that any act is completely safe.
"Risk" is an easier word to define as it deals with the probability of harm occurring and is subject to less opinion. Everything else being equal, you or I have the same risk of being struck by lighting. Yet our views could be at odds when asked if riding in a lighting storm is “safe”. You may view it is “safe” practice because it has an acceptable risk factor, I not.
The word “safe” when discussing cycling takes on a lot more opinion and emotion in its definition. “Safe” in cycling discussions contains two major parts, a quantitative and qualitative assessment. Risk, usually measured through statistics, is the quantitative assessment. I would argue that the qualitative assessment is opinion gained through one’s experience, perception or interpretation. The qualitative part is very powerful to cyclists or potential cyclists when they act. In some cases so strong that they will ignore the quantitative assessment altogether. A perfect example of this is riding a bicycle on a sidewalk. There is a wealth of statistics that clearly states that this practice is far more risky than riding on the road. Typically the practice of riding on the sidewalk is driven by the discomfort of sharing the road with much larger vehicles or just the road itself. This decision can also be influenced in a large part by factors that are not easily identified by statistics. A good example here would be the aggression cyclists face from drivers while riding on the road, whether the cyclist is in compliance or not with the rules of the road. Rarely do cyclists get hit by these aggressive drivers but it can make riding very unpleasant. Some time ago I heard cycling advocate Ben Smith-Lea describe the desire and importance by cyclists to have a pleasant ride described as the “quality of life on the road”. A quick read of any cycling advocacy website or face-to-face discussion amongst cyclists shows how important quality of life really is.
It is extremely important to understand that cyclists’ concerns are not unique nor do cyclists suffer from any sort of mass mental health issue as suggested by Vehicular Cycling. Drivers have the very same issues and they too will favour the qualitative assessment, and with good reason. Unlike cycling, there is more quantitative evidence supporting their assessments. They too have discomforts like sharing the road with large vehicles, non adherence to rules of the road, aggression, and so on, which bears out in statistics. In a stunning statistic referred to in an open letter by Ian Law published in the Toronto Star, nearly one in 17 cars in Ontario was involved in a collision in 2006. Other statistics point to aggression being the cause of up to 80% of collisions. This begs the question of how “safe” it is to advise cyclists that they are “safest when they behave like vehicles”? Especially when motor vehicle drivers and the conventions established for them to operate on the road that Vehicular Cycling practices have been modeled on are in such turmoil themselves.
Vehicular Cycling attempts to address the qualitative issues with questionable results and sometimes even uses unsupported “facts” to achieve this. Vehicular Cycling even attempts to dismiss the qualitative concerns by cyclists altogether by labeling them as a disease. This “disease” will be dealt with more directly in the second part of my post. There are three articles I have referenced in the following three paragraphs I would like to draw your attention to. One deals with the contrasts between a cyclist interested in not only being safer but in the quality of life and a Vehicular Cycling practitioner. The second makes a quantitative argument as to why cycling is “safe”, arguing that cycling is safer than most any other transportation choice. Finally the third takes a direct look at the qualitative assessment.
“Bike Lanes: A Motorist Invention” in The Urban Country by James D. Schwartz highlights the contrast between issues of quality of life versus the tenets of Vehicular Cycling. There may be a slight miss in the article when the Vehicular Cyclist is not challenged when he states that cyclists should not be given any special consideration on the roads. This conflicts with a Vehicular Cycling practice of “filtering”, a practice to give a cyclist an advantage in slow moving traffic. “Filtering” is in a legal gray area in several jurisdictions including Ontario. In others it is widely practiced even if illegal.
Ken Kifer makes an excellent quantitative argument that cycling is safe, even boasting that, “...bicycling is nearly six times as safe as living!” He also argues that the fatality/ injury rates could even be further reduced if more cyclists practiced Vehicular Cycling. Unfortunately he supports this reduction based on some of the more questionable attributions’, like the source of a cyclist's fear, of Vehicular Cycling.
Sociologist Dave Horton takes a hard look at the factors involved in qualitative assessments that are made by cyclists. This is a very well researched article and makes some excellent points. He does seem though to somewhat share a “conspiracy theory” with Vehicular Cycling of the invention of cycling as dangerous: “...The road safety industry, helmet promotion campaigns and anyone responsible for marketing off-road cycling facilities all have a vested interest in constructing cycling - particularly cycling on the road - as a dangerous practice...”
There is a myth in the cycling community that Vehicular Cycling tells cyclists to behave and drive like cars. This follows with protests that a bicycle can never be like a motorized vehicle. In its most base form Vehicular Cycling is proposing that we have a common approach to the road in order to best communicate with other road users. Any reasonable proposed practice to use on our roads would pretty much have to rely on similar mechanics.
The problem is that Vehicular Cycling founding father, John Forester, surrendered to the automobile before even considering any other approaches to use to communicate with other road users. He freely admits admits as much. Google Videos has a lecture by Mr. Forester where he provides his interpretation of history and how the car took the dominant role.
He chose to integrate his approach into the system of rules of the road that were established for the automobile; a system that was flawed even before he promoted Vehicular Cycling. Other forms of transportation: pedestrians, planes, and ships, for instance, have much lower incidents of collisions than automobiles. You had a much greater chance of dying in a car on 9/11 than you would have had had you been flying or been on a ship. These other modes of transportation use a much higher level of active communication that what is found in the rules of the road. Approaches like “Complete Streets” and “Naked Streets”, which Herb will deal with in greater detail, have proven how flawed the current rules of the road and street designs are.
There, too, is the problem that to this day the bicycle is not universally accepted, even in some North Americas jurisdictions, as a vehicle. Even if it is considered a vehicle, several jurisdictions treat the bicycle in its driver education manuals and highway laws as a nuisance. It could be argued quite easily, however, that this is not a flaw of Vehicular Cycling but a flaw created by lawmakers. A more relevant problem with Vehicular Cycling is that it is rigid and adverse to change, something that, again, we will later on touch on in greater detail. Things change, societies change, needs change, understandings change and any proposed method must be able to adapt. If it fails to adapt it becomes irrelevant and out of touch.
In my second part to follow I will take to task both some minor and major issues with Vehicular Cycling. I will be encouraging you to take another look at some so-called facts promoted by Vehicular Cycling enthusiasts. There will also be some simple social and driving (yes, with a car) experiments you can carry out on your own that may offer you a basis to alternative explanations to those of Vehicular Cycling dogma. I will also make a case as to why the “cyclist inferiority complex” is more junk psychology than it is fact.
Comments
anonymous (not verified)
Police 22 Division Bicycling awareness begins today
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 16:15I received this from a friend. I decided to remain anonymous because of the warning at the bottom.
>>> 5/3/2010 3:00 PM >>>
From May 03 to May 09th, 22 Division will take part in a Bicycle Awareness
Campaign.
Cyclists will be increasing in numbers as the weather warms up. To assist
with their safety and the safety of all road users, officers from 22
Division will be speaking to cyclists to ensure they are aware of the rules
of the road as the apply to them. Officers will also inspect the bicycles
to ensure they meet the requirements of the road.
If anyone wishes information in regards to bicycles on the roadways,
booklets can be picked up at 22 Division station and 22 substation. One of
the booklets is written towards new (younger) riders.
As always Drive / Ride safely.
Antonio Macias
Sergeant #1290
22 Division - Traffic Response Unit.
Toronto Police Service.
3699 Bloor Street West, Toronto,
Ontario, M9A 1A2
Telephone: 416-808-2224
Facsimile: 416-808-2202
This e-mail (including any attachments) may contain PRIVILEGED and
CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION only
for use of the Addressee(s). If you are not the intended recipient
of this e-mail or the employee or agent
responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are
hereby notified that any dissemination or copying
of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-
mail in error, please immediately notify me by
telephone or e-mail to arrange for the return or destruction of
this document. Thank you.
Darren_S
Passing on the right
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 17:48@JFJ
In the absence of any prohibition of an act under the HTA, common law takes over. This would require the cyclist to exercise due care when passing on the right as the HTA does not forbid. Though I guess it could be argued that s.147 requires cyclists to remain to the right cause they would normally be a slower vehicle.
JFJ (not verified)
... on the right
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 19:54Darren,
The sections of the HTA I quoted directs operators of a vehicle to pass on the left. That includes cyclists. An expressed prohibition would be redundant.
Darren_S
A right contradiction.
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 22:09@JFJ
Your read on the HTA is unworkable. In straight-through traffic when traveling slower than the faster moving motor traffic you stay on the right side of the lane(s.147(1)). When that traffic hits a compression and slows down you start passing the formerly faster moving vehicles to the left (s.148(5)), even though prior to that traffic slowing down you had enough room on the right. Alternatively you can stop or go slow and wait until the traffic speeds up if there is not enough room to the left of those vehicles(s.148(8)). Oh but wait, all of those now slower moving motor vehicles have now pulled to the right as required by the HTA (s.147(1))to allow you to pass. So now you are passing them to the left, but wait again. That motor vehicle traffic is now moving faster than you, so back to the right for you.
Seems like the only thing that will solve this is a bike lane.
Darren_S
Priority's influence over safety.
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 19:16Many comments have dealt with finding a practice that results in the least amount of harm/risk. This is a valid point if a cyclist's priority is the same, a practice that produces the least harm/risk. The question though is if the least amount of harm/risk desire is universally shared by cyclists. It could be something entirely different. It could be something conscious like the desire to not be sharing the same lane as larger vehicles. It could be something unconscious, a fear of large vehicles that is ingrained in one by evolution or sometimes referred to as natural self-preservation.
If it is the former and the cyclist understands the difference in risks their priority is shaping what they consider "safe" for better or worse. They made the choice. The latter too shapes what a cyclist considers "safe" even though the fear could be balanced with a skills course or research.
We could go on and on shoving risk statics around until we are blue in the face. It will not solve a thing until there is some clear idea of why cyclists make the decisions they do. That is also why observation and outcome stats are such a poor fit until the priority is known.
Now people might get up in arms and belittle anyone that picks another priority other than the least amount of risk/harm. With so much talk of rights in these comments how could anyone criticize one's right to chose? Especially when in most cases the difference in harm/risk between different practices is low.
JFJ (not verified)
Feelings trump facts? Not a good idea.
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 20:02Darren's post looks like a thinly veiled plea to let perceptions and feelings trump facts.
It's good that the phobia of fear of flying doesn't cause the aviation transportation authorities to make commercial airline travel riskier.
Seymore Bikes
Pass v. Fail
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 21:39Passing on the left of a right turning vehicle is generally my choice when I feel it is safe to do so.
The law does make a distinction that any vehicle that crosses the lane of another adjacent vehicle must yield to that vehicle. The best example I can think of would be when you are driving on a multi-lane highway; the driver must yield to the vehicle in the lane you are about to enter.
So by the same principle, a vehicle that has not yet initiated a right turn across a bike lane must yield to the approaching cyclist.
Of course physics has the final say, so judge wisely.
trikebum (not verified)
The right hook...
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 09:29> So by the same principle, a vehicle that has not yet initiated a right turn across a bike lane must yield to the approaching cyclist.
That's true but the driver doesn't 'see' the cyclist as their attention is only in the driving lane. That's why I ride there and not in a BL. Portland is famous for BLs and also for right hook cyclist deaths.
It has never been proven that BLS are safer than riding in the street obeying the rules of the road.
But BLs have been shown to be unsafe in many ways mainly by directing to the gutter where they can't be 'seen' so are not visible to distracted motorists with no peripheral vision. Look what happened in Ottawa last year when a motorist 'drifted' onto the Shoulder/BL (same thing) and wiped out 5 cyclists.
If you are integrated in traffic and controlling your lane you are highly visible and no driver will hit something in the road that they could avoid in time. Want to prove that theory? Just put a garbage can in the road.
trikebum (not verified)
The right hook...
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 09:29> So by the same principle, a vehicle that has not yet initiated a right turn across a bike lane must yield to the approaching cyclist.
That's true but the driver doesn't 'see' the cyclist as their attention is only in the driving lane. That's why I ride there and not in a BL. Portland is famous for BLs and also for right hook cyclist deaths.
It has never been proven that BLS are safer than riding in the street obeying the rules of the road.
But BLs have been shown to be unsafe in many ways mainly by directing to the gutter where they can't be 'seen' so are not visible to distracted motorists with no peripheral vision. Look what happened in Ottawa last year when a motorist 'drifted' onto the Shoulder/BL (same thing) and wiped out 5 cyclists.
If you are integrated in traffic and controlling your lane you are highly visible and no driver will hit something in the road that they could avoid in time. Want to prove that theory? Just put a garbage can in the road.
Seymore Bikes
Who's Bad?
Mon, 05/03/2010 - 22:15I have noticed that when people have a valid point to make on this site, they seem to do it without much trouble. Taking time to discredit others is lame, and generally an indication that an argument is lacking in credibility.
RANT WICK (not verified)
Good God.
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 01:14I know that people care deeply about this stuff, and that is laudable. This kind of squabbling, however, isn't doing anyone much good in my opinion. How about just accepting that there is a place for cyclists taking the lane or occupying a well designed bike lane or even a cycle track that works. Why the hell can't "mixed modes" apply to cyclists as well? That is the reality we all ride in. Any capable cyclist is best off knowing some VC stuff. Most transportation cyclists use the street, the bike lane and the path every damn day... so what's with all the hubbub? Ride your bike. Support what makes sense to you. Care about cycling and respect that other cyclists may want something you don't.
trikebum (not verified)
apologies...
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 09:49for the double post
Tom Flaherty
The Right Stuff
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 10:47Trikebum - Cyclists are required to ride on the right side if the road, so is makes sense to have designated facilities there. I understand the false sense of security that some riders may adopt when riding in a BL, but they do facilitate safe cycling and by a direct result, build the number of cyclists.
trikebum (not verified)
Not the right stuff
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 07:01> Trikebum - Cyclists are required to ride on the right side if the road, so is makes sense to have designated facilities there.
Not true only as right as practicable.If you need to take the lane for safety reasons that is permitted:
> HTA 147 - Slow moving traffic travel on right side
> any vehicle moving slower than the normal traffic speed should drive in the right-hand lane, or as close as practicable to the right edge of the road except when preparing to turn left or when passing another vehicle. For cyclists, you must ride far enough out from the curb to maintain a straight line, clear of sewer grates, debris, potholes, and parked car doors. You may occupy any part of a lane when your safety warrants it. Never compromise your safety for the convenience of a motorist behind you. http://tinyurl.com/da4qg2
If you had taken the full traffic lane while passing parked cars on Bloor St you would not have been doored. Your misinterpretation of the law could get you killed.
> I understand the false sense of security that some riders may adopt when riding in a BL, but they do facilitate safe cycling and by a direct result, build the number of cyclists.
BLs do not facillitate safe cycling, just the opposite.They will only 'build' the number of dead cyclists. And these will be the least trained I'm sorry to say.
Tom Flaherty
@ JFJ
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 10:55JFJ - Cyclists need to stay to the right of the road unless:
1. It is unsafe to do so
2. Passing a vehicle
3. Making a left hand turn
There are laws about riding single file also - please don't make me look them up.
JFJ (not verified)
More cycling myths ...
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 11:05Tom Flaherty. There is no prohibition against cycling two abreast in the HTA. Depending on where you live in Ontario, there may be local by-laws.
As for your other comments, well that's just an opinion and not required by the HTA except as described in my previous explanation.
It might be useful to look up the facts and quote them before posting, otherwise you are just helping to give more weight to myths, of which there are many when it comes to cycling.
Darren_S
s.150
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 11:14S.150 essentially fixes a problem with preceding sections of the HTA on passing as it relates to motor vehicles. Without it cars could get stopped behind left turning vehicles. Case law bears that out.
Tom Flaherty
I Said Please..
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 11:54JFJ - Stay to the right means stay to the right, if you are riding beside another cyclists and you are not passing you can get charged under the HTA under Section 147 or 148:
147.(1) Any vehicle travelling upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at that time and place shall, where practicable, be driven in the right-hand lane then available for traffic or as close as practicable to the right hand curb or edge of the roadway.
148.(1) Every person in charge of a vehicle on a highway meeting another vehicle shall turn out to the right from the centre of the roadway, allowing the other vehicle one-half of the roadway free.
148.(6) Every person on a bicycle or motor assisted bicycle who is overtaken by a vehicle or equestrian travelling at a greater speed shall turn out to the right and allow the vehicle or equestrian to pass and the vehicle or equestrian overtaking shall turn out to the left so far as may be necessary to avoid a collision.
There is always interpretation in the application of the law, I think you might be taking things too literally.
JFJ (not verified)
... keep on pushing myths
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 12:11Tom Flaherty - so what are saying is accept your interpretation rather than what's written ....
I'm afraid you are out of your depth.
Judicial interpretation occurs if there is ambiguity and usually applies to constitutional law. There is no ambiguity in the sections of the HTA that I quoted. Learn how to parse sentences especially section 147 (1).
Tom Flaherty
Out of My Depth?
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 13:42JFJ,
The information in my previous post was copied direct from the HTA on sections that have been referred to me by the professionals that enforce the law - it was not "parsed" as you say.
I have discussed this issue at length with Police, including two Traffic Sergeants, so these are not my interpretations – I’m not qualified to interpret the law.
The fact is that interpretation is everything to the Police, as they have to decide which law is best applied in a particular situation. For example, I left out Sec 154. (1) - Failure to ride in marked lane, which may also be applied to cyclists riding two abreast.
I hope this helps.
JFJ (not verified)
Yes, out of your depth ...
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 13:44Police don't interpret the law, they enforce what is written. I don't care for hearsay, it's not worth a pinch of ...
Section154. (1) is a non-sequitur.
Hey if you want to live in a mythical world, you are free to do so. Lot's of other cyclists do as do many police officers.
I can lead a horse to water but I can't ...
... well you'll get my drift.
Tom Flaherty
Busted
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 15:34JFJ,
I have tried my best to give you good unbiased information here, as has Herb, Darren & John, and all you do is provide mocking insults and awkward legal advice.
Call Sec 154 (1) "non-seqitor" (or whatever), but it's direct information form the same people that are going to give you a ticket for the offence.
I'll leave you to learn this stuff by personal experience, for some people it's best that way, then you can explain your "mythical" concept to the Police Officer who is left to interpret your actions.
JFJ (not verified)
Been there, done that ....
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 16:21Tom Flaherty,
I've been in court on more than one occasion and have yet to lose ...
I take it your experience is all theoretical.
Tom Flaherty
The JFJ Experience
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 16:58Really you won in court - that's great.
I have been able to successfully make my point with the attending Officer on the few occaissions where it was required - which has left me ticket free so far - so no, not theoretical.
Darren_S
Sorry Tom,
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 17:37...but JFJ is correct as so far as the riding two abreast is concerned. The HTA empowers municipalities as to whether or not riding two abreast is illegal or not. The by-law number that covers Toronto cyclists is 14(1).
Cops do charge under the HTA because they simply do not bother looking things up. The copy of the HTA they have with them is a short version and does not get into specifics. I have seen several tickets now that were written for a cycling infraction but only applied to a motor vehicle. I have video of a smug cop threatening a cyclist with a charge that is a glorified parking ticket for a car. The cop thought he was being really smart.
Cops that are assigned to a traffic unit tend to have a better grasp on things and do a better job of writing the right ticket. Cops that are assigned to a more general type of unit depend more heavily on their police issued short version of the HTA.
Here is a partial copy of it. Notice the first entry. This is why many cyclists during blitzes get improperly charged with no lights at high noon on a bright sunny day.
http://www.toronto.ca/cycling/pdf/hta.pdf
The case R. v Bunda gives us some insight as to how the courts have interpreted s.150 and riding abreast with respect to motor vehicles.
Do cops interpret the law? Absolutely. They charge based on their interpretation and it is up to the courts to decide if the interpretation is valid and if not the court applies its interpretation. Once the courts have provided enough direction the cops then tend to fall in line. A good of example where there is a lot of interpretation going on is the new stunt driving law. The law is still being shaped by the courts as new and wonderful ways it has been applied have been challenged.
"...Judicial interpretation occurs if there is ambiguity and usually applies to constitutional law..."-JFJ
This is way out on left base. Our legal system uses a lot of 'judge made law' or precedence. One would be very hard pressed to find a section of the HTA that has not been interpreted by the courts in one way or another less than three times.
JFJ (not verified)
Sorry Darren ...
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 20:15I read R v. Bunda and at no time did the judge interpret the law or try to rewrite the law. Where there was doubt about definition or ambiguity he correctly referred to case law. What he did do was interpret the behaviour of the appellant, compared it to the wording of section 150 and then found him guilty as charged.
This finding was totally consistent with the law as written, unlike Tom's "interpretation" of section 147(1) whose structure and grammar would have to be changed to find a cyclist guilty for not riding to the far right when he's riding in a right hand lane.
Darren_S
R v. Bunda
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 20:54@JFJ - It set a precedence for what is considered an element of "stunt driving". The accused tried using s.150 as a defence.
Tom Flaherty
Review
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 19:47Thanks for the input Darren - but I don't see how Sec. 150 applies to the cycling two abreast situation.
I recently beat a ticket for 'failure to ride on the right', by demonstrating that I was preparing to make a left hand turn, but it took some time to get to that point with the Cop who pulled me over. He admitted he had just had a debate with a colleague on the issue the day prior and had spent some time earlier that AM reviewing the HTA - I think we can all agree that the (non-traffic services) Police don't always get bike laws right.
I followed this up with a discussion with the Traffic Sergeant at his division, who was very helpful. I shared his take with another TS who agreed, and I got some more Q & A with him too.
I'm not making any claims of my own other than sharing the specifics I've got from the Police (at Traffic Services), specific to: 'obstructing faster moving traffic' and 'failure to ride in marked lane'.
I am familiar with the by-law for Toronto, but in the absence of such a by-law, I would challenge anybody to prove to me that a cyclist had the right to ride in a manner that unnecessarily obstructed the flow of faster moving traffic, whether by riding two abreast or otherwise.
Darren_S
Tom - s.150
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 20:54Tom I only offered the case as an insight as to what a judge considers in their decision.
The most likely explanation for your situation is that the cops did not consider any by-laws. Many view it as a waste seeing the fines are so low. Unfortunately once you are charged the onus is on you to prove they misapplied the law. Most people do not even research their charge. They just pay the ticket and that is how the cops get away with it.
I hear about two cyclists a year getting charged with criminal mischief for riding two abreast or blocking traffic. Sheer madness but it is up to the cyclist to prove it is wrong. As far as I know all of the charges were eventually dropped or reduced.
JFJ (not verified)
not guilty, your honour ...
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 21:31The first step is to send in an intent to enter a not guilty plea. This is followed by a request for disclosure from the prosecution. Disclosure is the Crown's statement of its case and evidence they intend to use against the defendant in court. Once the request has been made, the Crown prosecutor has to look at the cop's case and decide if it's worth pursuing. It's then that it's found out in cycling cases that the cop was probably wrong (ie he misinterpreted the law), that is unless he gets someone for no bell, horn or gong on bike.
If disclosure is not received, the defendant must show up in court intending to plead not guilty. Then the case is normally withdrawn by the Crown. This is because the JP will throw it out anyway on grounds that the Crown failed to furnish its case to the defendant (this is a constitutional right). If the defendant doesn't show, the court assumes that the defendant has conceded the case and disclosure then becomes irrelevant.
It's a surprise to me that the cycling community in Toronto doesn't seem to be aware of the fundamental rights of cyclists in disputes with the law. It should spend less time trying to shut down the city in rush hour and more time getting its facts straight, but then facts seem to be elusive in certain sectors of the Toronto cycling community.
Darren_S
JFJ - In honour of?
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 14:20JFJ I do not know what your post is in honour of other than to support your contention, and your contention alone, that Toronto cyclists are ignorant.
JFJ missed an important step at the beginning of the process per the Provincial Offences Act that can get one's ticket tossed before it even sees a courtroom. Surprising seeing it is supported by the very same case law JFJ cited for disclosure.
Getting disclosure is not a requirement for the accused, it is their choice as to whether or not to get it. The prosecutor has the ability to deny it if they feel that the accused is not fit. Very rarely does this happen for traffic tickets besides maybe very serious collisions or fatalities. They can ask that it only goes to your counsel as they are more strictly bound by the rules of the court. Again very rare in traffic court.
Disclosure is good but you also need to know what to look for once you get it. That is something where competent counsel comes in. They know where to look and what to challenge.
There are also time limits and allowances that must be observed when requesting disclosure. Ask for it the night before the trial and you will get laughed at if you ask for it to be tossed when they do not have it. Competent counsel will also know what to do if your request for disclosure is not fulfilled and the JP goes ahead with the trial anyways.
With run-of-the-mill traffic tickets the prosecutor will probably only see the ticket about 5 minutes before trial. (The last trial at Markham Rd I was at, all of the cop-prosecutor conferences were done right in from the of the accused with everybody else watching.) Unless of course the cop themselves are prosecuting. A common occurrence in Scarborough courts. The cops are surprisingly quite good at the role.
Can you get tickets scuttled by talking to the cop and/or their superiors after being issued as in Tom's case? While you have to be careful not to annoy them (very risky) it can be done provided you can give solid reasons and they are willing to listen. Some people have done this and have just ended up giving the cops more evidence to use against them. You will still have to appear in court if the cop agrees that you did not deserve the charge but the cop will either not show or tell the JP that they have no evidence to present.
In the end, if you are going to fight a ticket it is best to get counsel, either a paralegal or lawyer, as soon as possible. There are many more ins and outs in traffic court than most would imagine.
JFJ (not verified)
Darrenout of his depth again
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 19:09More theoretical stuff from Darren and is far from what actually happens. Para-legals are great to plea bargain on behalf of motorists , usually speeding tickets. Example, driver was going 180km/h but accepts a reduced charge of driving 130km/h - much lower fine fewer points deducted. That's where para-legals earn their money. Most know diddly about cycling infractions and lawyers even less. You'll be wasting your money using either.
Cyclists who unjustly get tickets should do the research and represent themselves. They should read what I described before and read very carefully the section of the HTA that they are charged with. Unless the prosecution can prove a person did not do exactly what the HTA wording requires a cyclist or driver of a vehicle to do, then there's an excellent chance the defendant will win. For example, I know someone who got charged with an HTA infraction while riding in a group. The cop chose one person in the group and wrote a ticket even though he didn't know or couldn't recall whether the defendant was riding on the inside line or the outside line of the group, or at the front or back. It never got to court once disclosure was requested.
I have acted on behalf of others in court (including motorist tickets) . Darren hasn't. I've never lost.
Seymore Bikes
Dancing around like you think you're Janet Jackson
Thu, 05/06/2010 - 07:20Seriously JFJ, get down from your high horse and stop gushing condescending crap. It would be better if you stuck to sharing information without the prickly taunts.
JFJ (not verified)
Black is white?
Thu, 05/06/2010 - 15:14Michael,
The sanctimony and mythmaking in this thread needed to be countered. It used to be that facts always trumped opinions and feelings. As for sharing information, read the whole thread. For example, I've explained how to deal with tickets and the justice system, but I guess you'd rather believe someone who spouts the theory. Oh yes, Michael you always did live in a hairy, fairy world of make believe. Once again you confirmed it from afar.
Yours
Sister Janet
locutas_of_spragge
opinions and feelings
Fri, 05/07/2010 - 01:25"JFJ", to the extent you've provided facts, about, say, the Ontario Highway Traffic Act and Ontario traffic courts, I'll say thank you for contributing to the discussion.If I ever get into a traffic situation involving the police, I'll consult my solicitor and the bike union, but I will give your advice its due weight.
But I will point out that most of the controversies surrounding vehicular cycling involve not what the law says but what it ought to say, less about the dismal road safety statistics than what we ought to do to improve them. Ultimately, the debate between so-called vehicular cyclists and many people on this board, or as I would put it, the debate between accomodationist cyclists and reformist cyclists involves values.
Speaking for myself, as a sailor, a cyclist, a licensed pilot and, yes, a motorist, I want to end the culture of impunity surrounding the automobile. I want to see dangerous driving defined correctly, as a violent act. I want people who kill other people by crashing cars into them at 90 km/h over the posted speed limit to get the same sentence as people who kill other people by firing Uzis at them. I want motorists held absolutely responsible for operating their vehicles safely. I want the words "I didn't see..." or "I didn't know..." to count as aggravating, not mitigating factors. I don't want this so much because I think that will substantially reduce the use of private automobiles, although I do think it the prospect of actual Canadian murder sentences for killing people with cars would stop the majority of street racers cold. I want motorists held to account without fear or favour because the notion of a protected class of people using a technology as dangerous as the private car offends my values and my sense that justice means equality before the law.
Tom Flaherty
Insight
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 21:59Thanks Darren - Criminal Mischief eh? Wouldn't have figured that one.
I have to agree with you about the level of awareness with a regular PC on Bike laws.
I remember speaking with an officer that attended when I got a "Door Prize" and he asked what I wanted. I said I wanted the passenger charged with 'Improper opening of a vehicle door', and he replied, " That's not against the law".
I emailed him the HTA Sec. later that day (UGH).
Tom Flaherty
Gong Show
Tue, 05/04/2010 - 21:45I think it would be a sensational way of drawing attention to the lack of knowledge on Bike Law by fixing a gong to your bike - classic!
locutas_of_spragge
vehicular cycling...
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 04:14I suspect we all want cyclists to ride as well and safely as possible. We have a number of different opinions about how best to do that, but almost all our disagreements concern the manner in which we facilitate safe cycling. And here Darren puts it quite correctly, in my opinion: the problem with what its advocates call "vehicular cycling" has less with the behaviour advocated for individual cyclists, and and far more to do with the larger outlook of many of its advocates.
A comment earlier in this thread makes for a good example. 'JFJ" wrote:
This seems to imply that our current prosperity depends on a transportation paradigm which, for a substantial minority of people, depends on the private automobile, I have three responses to this: first of all, we can't define "better" and "worse" ways to live; the distinction involves too many issues of subjective judgment. Secondly, even on its own terms, the argument remains highly questionable; by many estimates, the cost to the user and to society of the private automobile outweighs all of the benefits. But the real issue involves the elephant on the motorway that vehicular cyclists don't talk about. Forester alludes to this obliquely when he writes of the many ways motorists have developed a dependency on the private car.
Dependency, like any addiction, degrades the addict. As individuals, we experience that degradation in many ways; a sedentary, car dependent lifestyle has links to almost as many debilitating and life-shortening conditions as a dependency on cigarettes. For society as a whole, having a large and influential minority dependent on the car has produced a very specific form of degradation: impunity for motorists. We see this reflected in the death toll on the highways, the "special" laws which provide significantly lower penalties for causing injury or death with a car in all but a few of the most egregious circumstances, the "no-fault" insurance laws which shield drivers from the normal civil consequences of causing serious harm to other people, the ease with which jurisdictions hand out licenses to drive and the extreme reluctance to revoke them, and the occasional tolerance shown to egregious acts of road rage.
Because too many people view the removal of a driver's license as having unacceptable lifestyle consequences, courts do not do it, which means that cyclists cannot count on sharing the road with even marginally competent or ethical drivers. When a cyclist dies in a crash, the driver involved almost never faces the consequences a person who committed homicide with a gun or a knife would face. Until vehicular cycling advocates address this issue, I don't think they have a lot to say. As someone who generally follows good vehicular cycling practices, I get harassed about once for every 20-40km I ride, with close passes, honked horns, swearing, and so on. To the extent that Forester and his followers dismiss the very reasonable fears of cyclists while ignoring both the impunity enjoyed by drivers, and the addictive system that makes the impunity necessary, I believe they discredit their own position.
trikebum (not verified)
What about novice cyclists?
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 07:21I floated this question twice:
> And what will novice cyclists do to get where the BL begins and when the BL stops if they have no road training or experience? The sidewalk ?
What would a competent vehicular cyclist or CanBike instructor recommend?
I ask this because if we're going to 'grow' new cyclists they have to come from somewhere and obviously not from the ranks of the experienced.
herb
ride safely in lane
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 11:35This looks like a leading question, trikebum. As an instructor, I recommend that people bike safely in a bike lane or in a regular lane.
If it's a bike lane ride in the middle. If it's a regular width lane go 1 metre from the curb. If it's a narrow lane and the relative speed is similar to the cyclists then take the lane. If drivers behind get annoyed or start threatening cyclists for taking the lane (which I've had numerous times) then the choice for the cyclist is to find another route (good luck), pull over to let the offending cars go, or stay put in the middle of the lane and put up with all the abuse of the drivers' road rage (very few will follow this last option).
A bike lane helps cyclists to claim that space a metre out as well as demarcate a space so drivers won't drift as often into the curb space.
Novice cyclists could certainly use some tips on getting into and out of bike lanes. I encourage them to take a course, but it also looks like most of them figure it out.
trikebum (not verified)
Novice cyclists could certainly use some tips?
Fri, 05/07/2010 - 09:01Hmmph! Tips indeed. And who will give them these 'tips'? Other people who ride in bike lanes? The answer I was hoping for from a CanBike instructor was that while everyone is waiting for BLs they should learn to ride on the road according to the rules of the road, and the best way to that would be to take an accredited training course.This is what Effective Cycling and CanBike were created for. Do you not agree?
> Novice cyclists could certainly use some tips on getting into and out of bike lanes. I encourage them to take a course, but it also looks like most of them figure it out.
I don't think wrong-way riders, sidewalk riders and scofflaws have it figured out at all. Do you?
In pursuing an agenda of building BLs on the premise of attracting people to take up cycling, the newcomers will be innocent pawns in a game of politics. They are the ones who will come to harm, not the ones who have road training or have 'figured it out.'
I would like think that a CanBike instructor would not merely suggest, but to actively promote education as the cornerstone in any programme designed to increase cycling. Right now, those who clamour for BLs only give lip service to education, if they consider it at all.
I'd really like to know how many people took a CB course in TO in the last few years as compared to how many newbies. Do you have any figures? Any guesses?
herb
you asked for tips
Fri, 05/07/2010 - 11:45You asked for tips for passing on the right so I gave them to you. You're the one who is getting all dramatic on how dangerous it is to pass on the right. I counter that, in fact, most cyclists do it safely a lot of the time, because cars are not turning right or they have slowed down or stopped in rush hour traffic.
I think you're ridiculous. The bike lanes are there now and people are using them. So you're suggesting we rip them all out and then force education on all cyclists first?
I do not believe that a well-built bike lane encourages cyclists to pass on the right. All bike lanes in Toronto end before the intersections to encourage intermingling. Where there's a right hand turn lane, the city has put the bike lanes to the left of the turning lane.
You're trying to force people to choose one or the other. Either we educate everyone or no one gets educated but we all get bike lanes. It's a stupid dichotomy and it's unrealistic.
Tom Flaherty
Out of Lane
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 10:31Trikebum
I got “doored” while passing on the right of a vehicle stopped in the middle of a lane, with a metre of space I should have had no problem passing the car. If I had the option of a Bike Lane I would have likely had adequate space to pass without the threat of a car door. Besides, why would I take the lane when both lanes were filled by vehicles stopped & idling?
If you have some concise data that shows that Bike Lanes are unsafe then please provide it. Did you happen to check out the NYC Dept. of Transportation website? There is plenty of information there that you might find interesting.
I am not misinformed about the Sec. you refer to (147) – I actually understand it pretty well.
trikebum (not verified)
I got “doored” while passing on the right...
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 14:59> ...of a vehicle stopped in the middle of a lane, with a metre of space I should have had no problem passing the car. If I had the option of a Bike Lane I would have likely had adequate space to pass without the threat of a car door. Besides, why would I take the lane when both lanes were filled by vehicles stopped & idli
So you filtered to the right and into the motorists' door zone/blind spot? ** If there was a BL the motorist would probably have stopped in it and the situation would have ended the same**
I would suggest that a competent vehicular cyclist would have the choice of
1. merging into the adjacent lane if able to anticipate in time, if not,
2. stopping behind (like any other vehicle) and waiting for the vehicle ahead to resume travel, or
3. filter to the right in a watchful careful manner. This would be the least safe maneuver but most cyclists do it anyway, I sometimes do myself fully understanding the consequences of doors and right turning vehicles.
Tom Flaherty
Trikebum Filter
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 17:56I passed on the right in what would normally be considered a safe space - you know the side where the passenger door is? (in case that wasn't already obvious).
If there was a BL and the car pulled into it, I would have no choice but to turn to pass on the left - so NO, not the same.
All good now?
trikebum (not verified)
Normally? By whom?
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 18:38> I passed on the right in what would normally be considered a safe space - you know the side where the passenger door is? (in case that wasn't already obvious).
I'm sorry, no disrespect but passing on the right is never a safe place. It puts you in the motorists' blind spot. And I have to ask; who would 'normally' consider that a safe place?
Tom Flaherty
Skill Testing Question
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 22:34OK Trikebum - Enlighten me
Situation:
You are cycling along a four lane, two way street. The two west bound lanes are packed with stopped traffic. You want to proceed west safely, so you should:
a) Stop in the middle of the lane leaving a safe distance between the vehicle ahead of you and wait for traffic to advance;
b) Steer to the right, stop, dismount, and proceed on foot using the sidewalk;
c) Pass in the middle of both westbound lanes using caution;
d) Pass on the right hand side of the roadway using caution;
e) Phone a friend
Of course it wouldn't surprise me if you found another option. I await your answer.
trikebum (not verified)
Riding 2 way 4 lane roads
Thu, 05/06/2010 - 08:57I believe you know my position from my comments on May 5, 2010 - 1:59pm.
On a 2 way 4-lane road my default lane position is in the middle of the curb lane unless there is room (12' or wider lane) to share with motorized traffic safely. If I feel traffic is passing too close too fast I will not share my lane. If they want to drive like that they will have to change lanes. Do I get the odd honk from the odd ill-informed motorist when I do this? Sometimes.....but honks don't kill and at last I know they've seen me.
Just yesterday I was going down a 1 way 2 lane street with parked cars on each side doing what I do as the lane was narrow, when I got a honk from behind. When I stopped at a light, the woman driver came up on my right making a RH turn and yelled that I was not a car!
I laughed and said "but I am a vehicle".
herb
so simplistic
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 22:59Um, actually you're being simplistic and ridiculous, trikebum. And considering we can't verify your authority on the subject, I'd say people should just ignore your advice.
There are plenty of times when passing on the right is a "safe place." It all depends on the context and the amount of space on the right. Even CAN-BIKE says there are situations where passing on the right is alright.
It is not just "blind spots" that are at issue. In fact, every car has blind spots on both sides. The issue is to not pass on the right when the car is turning right, and not when you have to "squeeze". The rule of thumb is to have 2 metres of space, at least that's what I've gleaned from CB.
Darren_S
JFJ
Wed, 05/05/2010 - 19:15One time in band camp...
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